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CNG explosion
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cnguru



Anmeldedatum: 22.05.2016
Beiträge: 12

BeitragVerfasst am: 23.05.2016 12:03 Beitrag speichern    Titel: CNG explosion Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

On 4th MAY 2016 VW Touran exploded 1 of rear tanks again, as allways, during filling CNG - see picture. It happened in Czech republic, town Litomysl, GAJER pump including CNG and also regular petrol/diesel station.

Severe corrosion on tanks is clearly visible.





As always before, it happened during CNG filling progress of severely corroded tanks, the degree of corrosion is very clear from pictures.

Fortunately explosion again was absent of fire, nevertheless in radius 20 meters were significant damages of cars and pump equipment.
One person, innocent bystander from different car !! was hit only !! by piece of plastic and injured lower leg (superficial injury) requiring short term hospitalisation.

The driver was sitting inside Touran Ecofuel, with no injury, but is facing now up to imprisonment for 2 years of general endangerment (every one/two year TUW check of gas system in CZ is required, but nobody in TUW is opening tank plastic covers, using mirror for invisible tank parts..., usually only clear gas leak is checked...etc)

Here are example links to czech servers:

http://www.denik.cz/pardubicky-kraj/na-pumpe-vybuchla-cng-lahev-primo-pod-autem-obsluha-cerpacky-utrpela-zraneni-20160504-igbl.html

http://www.auto.cz/na-svitavsku-vybuchla-autu-pri-cerpani-tlakova-nadrz-na-plyn-94993


So, in summary:
As people here in this great erdgas server know true, this is at least 3rd explosion, allways, same reason, tanks corrosion, and again Touran. The previous two links:

http://www.merkur-online.de/lokales/wolfratshausen/wolfratshausen/gasexplosion-mann-schwer-verletzt-2444684.html

http://www.erdgasfahrer-forum.de/viewtopic.php?t=13658&highlight=explodiert

We all remember the moment of purchase once the dealer was give us the assuranceof no danger, after 20 years the tanks will be tested and used even longer. This is stil included in maintenace chart (VW - workshop guidelines).

The VW reality is, after 5 yeas EVERY VW-CNG (Ecofuel) car needs at least all tanks replacement for deadly corrosion, for 4-6000 eur, after 7 years forget any good-will from VW. Then those cars (not all, definitely substantial amount) will be sold to countries with less strict, less carefull TUW rules (Czech republic and more south east direction) where they will only search for wounded and victims. This will be price for VW preference of saves on tanks painting, no Zn-Galvanizing, even years after first deadly problems were identified.

I will post here every single explosion found, expecting VW change strategy and recall all Ecofuel cars older 5 years and any next 5 years, to replace deadly tanks for free up to they will be safe and preventing killing not only drivers but innocent bystanders also!!!

This time: Das VW-CNG auto...Deadly VW-CNG auto
Next time???
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anacronataff



Anmeldedatum: 09.08.2010
Beiträge: 2427
Wohnort: L-Gas Gebiet

BeitragVerfasst am: 23.05.2016 12:25 Beitrag speichern    Titel: Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

Thank you for this report. I totally agree.

Wolfratshausen
Schweden
Tschechien
_________________
Passat EF 1.4TSI DSG MJ02/2010: 215200km (2089km wg Tanken), 5.53 €/100km, Gesamt: 30.29 €/100km * Service Intervalle * CNG-Reichweiten * CNG-Tankrekorde mit 21kg Tanks * Fotos und Video der CNG-Flaschen * eigene POI's mit Navigon
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cnguru



Anmeldedatum: 22.05.2016
Beiträge: 12

BeitragVerfasst am: 23.05.2016 22:02 Beitrag speichern    Titel: CNG explosion Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

anacronataff hat Folgendes geschrieben:
Thank you for this report. I totally agree.

Wolfratshausen
Schweden
Tschechien



Thanks all of you doing good job here, showing reality of VW-CNG, corrosion, EM valves, gas regulator..., especially thanks to Bassmann and others...

Lets collect CNG explosions here.

Possible solution: Once I found in 2014 corrosion on 2 of 3 tanks (Passat 2009), goodwill was partly offered, before mounting new tanks I did Zn-galvanizing + new highly resistent painting in Czech republic. All 3 tanks done for etw 500eur. After two years (not much) looks perfect, will see next years...
Unfortunately, this makes sense only with new tanks, once corroded, no way - replacement is neccesary. But who knows whether last generation of VW-painting of tanks is good enough?? At least new thicker Zn-bands are used instead of previous steel-painted....
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Bassmann
Site Admin


Anmeldedatum: 24.04.2006
Beiträge: 28747
Wohnort: Zu hause.

BeitragVerfasst am: 23.05.2016 22:46 Beitrag speichern    Titel: Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

It's good to read that no one was injured severely.

Of course we try to collect infos about rusty tanks as we did before.

No one with rusty tanks must admit to be told that VW thinks he is the first to come with that problem. There are lots of people who have the same problems.

Friendly greetings!
Bassmann
_________________
13 Zylinder, 4,25 Liter Hubraum, aber verteilt auf 2 Autos und 2 Motorräder:
Golf4 Kombi 1.6l autom. mit CNG-Nachrüstung, ca. 10€/100km
Polo4 9N3 united 1.4l 5-Gang mit CNG-Nachrüstung, ca. 8€/100km
(jeweils incl. Luxusbrühe)
Motorräder: 644ccm Suzuki Freewind (Eintopf), 600ccm Yamaha Fazer
Wenn Ruth albert, ruht Albert. Ruht Ruth, albert Albert.
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cnguru



Anmeldedatum: 22.05.2016
Beiträge: 12

BeitragVerfasst am: 23.05.2016 23:45 Beitrag speichern    Titel: cng explosion Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

Yes, thanks Bassmann, but times between explosions are getting shorter...more injured are expected...especially in CZ where old cars import is huge.
By the way, first explosion in Wolfratshausen - you posted it was only 3 year old Touran?
Last corrosion was published in your forum 2016 with 2012 Ecofuel, what do you think about last anticorrosive VW protection...is home based Zn-galvanising still necessary on new tanks??
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Bassmann
Site Admin


Anmeldedatum: 24.04.2006
Beiträge: 28747
Wohnort: Zu hause.

BeitragVerfasst am: 24.05.2016 00:01 Beitrag speichern    Titel: Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

We hope VW has learned the lesson. And since we don't have hints, that the tanks of Up/citigo/mii as well as the tanks of Leon/Octavia (Golf and Audi A3 are non-steel) make problems, we hope the nightmare is over.

Yours Bassmann
_________________
13 Zylinder, 4,25 Liter Hubraum, aber verteilt auf 2 Autos und 2 Motorräder:
Golf4 Kombi 1.6l autom. mit CNG-Nachrüstung, ca. 10€/100km
Polo4 9N3 united 1.4l 5-Gang mit CNG-Nachrüstung, ca. 8€/100km
(jeweils incl. Luxusbrühe)
Motorräder: 644ccm Suzuki Freewind (Eintopf), 600ccm Yamaha Fazer
Wenn Ruth albert, ruht Albert. Ruht Ruth, albert Albert.
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cnguru



Anmeldedatum: 22.05.2016
Beiträge: 12

BeitragVerfasst am: 24.05.2016 07:30 Beitrag speichern    Titel: cng explosion Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

Yes passat Ecofuel is over - no more available since 2015 B8, went to electrostaff...
Unfortunately.
It was great balance between cng/petrol distance radius in passat.

The way of making new technology working properly in longterm horizon is allways long, 10years??, giving many lessons and improoving components.
Just before reaching this point passat was withdrawn....

But still VW should offer responsibility and recall all old tanks replacement for free, as all custumers by purchase were mistaken by tank lifespan more than 20 years...
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Frosch



Anmeldedatum: 08.09.2014
Beiträge: 202

BeitragVerfasst am: 27.05.2016 09:22 Beitrag speichern    Titel: Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

Sorry, but the tank isn`t exploded. It has burst.
There`s no sign of fire at the tank or the car.

Nevertheless this Touran had a known problem with rust. The owner should have change his tanks bevor bursting ...

Is there no "TÜV" in Czech Republic?
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cnguru



Anmeldedatum: 22.05.2016
Beiträge: 12

BeitragVerfasst am: 27.05.2016 23:48 Beitrag speichern    Titel: CNG explosion Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

Lets make it clear: Strictly a physical process, as opposed to chemical or nuclear, e.g., the bursting of a sealed or partially sealed container under internal pressure is often referred to as a 'mechanical explosion'.The contents of the container may cause a subsequent „chemical explosion“, the effects of which can be dramatically more serious in the presence of an ignition source. For this reason, emergency workers often differentiate between the two events.


So , fortunately we have „only“ 3 documented mechanical explosions, one severe and one mild injury. And from those pictures (note the shoot through garage door 30m apart) Im not happy. My wife is not happy too, so I pay attention she doesnt even see those pictures.
In case of chemical-fire explosion we have victims for sure. I rather dont think about power of energy released in one second used for at least 2-3 hours ongoing CNG vehicle.
Now, VW gave a present to the world: Full explosions responsibility is passed to TUV authorities. But is it surely set and prepared ? Is it typical for TUV facing possible 5-10 years cars explosion ever before? Explosion in Germany 2012, Sweden 2015, Czech 2016, next?? Every TUV authority is properly instructed about VW tanks at least in Europe and will now identifiy any rusty tank? Did every European TUV received special VW check requirements? Maybe in Germany, even not 100% for sure. But all others CNG cars are moving through all Europe and fill up their tanks in regular mixed pumps CNG/petrol/diesel...are Europeans at fuel pumps safe??? If not now, when they will be?? I think never, becoming worse. It maybe changed only if VW retains responsibility and recalls all possibly affected CNG cars ANYTIME and does so even in subsequent years for particular car. Definitely vast majority, if not all CNG owners are happy to be involved....500eur Zn-galvanizing or victims, das auto???

Finally, here is part of VW maintenance service chart with clear expected gas tanks lifespan 20years to exchange, this is what we got with car purchase and we all know reality.


http://www.erdgasfahrer-forum.de/viewtopic.php?t=8882&start=165&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=









Änderungsgrund von sparbrötchen: Möin, Ich habe mal einen Absatz spendiert. Sparbrötchen
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anacronataff



Anmeldedatum: 09.08.2010
Beiträge: 2427
Wohnort: L-Gas Gebiet

BeitragVerfasst am: 05.07.2016 08:20 Beitrag speichern    Titel: Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

The fourth exploded Touran!

Wolfratshausen
Schweden 1
Tschechien
Schweden 2
_________________
Passat EF 1.4TSI DSG MJ02/2010: 215200km (2089km wg Tanken), 5.53 €/100km, Gesamt: 30.29 €/100km * Service Intervalle * CNG-Reichweiten * CNG-Tankrekorde mit 21kg Tanks * Fotos und Video der CNG-Flaschen * eigene POI's mit Navigon
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Hälge



Anmeldedatum: 11.07.2015
Beiträge: 20

BeitragVerfasst am: 05.07.2016 21:04 Beitrag speichern    Titel: Sweden: EcoFuel Touran recall as of 2016-07-05 announced Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

In Sweden, the 2nd (mechanical) explosion of a Touran got a reaction rather fast (as I reported today in the thread [in German]: http://www.erdgasfahrer-forum.de/viewtopic.php?p=141442#141442...

Sweden got today an official VW recall of the EcoFuel Tourans built 2006-2009.
For details see (and Google-translate) the following sources:
The press release [in Swedish] from 2016-07-05:
http://news.cision.com/se/volkswagen-personbilar/r/volkswagen-uppmanar-agare-av-touran-ecofuel-2006-2009-att-lamna-in-bilen-i-ny-sakerhetsrelaterad-ate,c2041530

as PDF-file:
http://mb.cision.com/Main/596/2041530/537042.pdf

I have a feeling (or suspicion) -- note my careful wording, not a factual information, I am still trying to get evidence... -- it may the very same action as reported here previously:
http://www.erdgasfahrer-forum.de/viewtopic.php?p=141340#141340

A different wording and stated as an idea, a thought, nothing more... -- this might have been planned to be carried through while doing a regular service, the 2nd explosion/bursting (and media coverage) made, at least VW (Sweden) reconsider their option(s)...

Kind Regards,
Hälge
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cnguru



Anmeldedatum: 22.05.2016
Beiträge: 12

BeitragVerfasst am: 14.07.2016 15:10 Beitrag speichern    Titel: CNG explosion Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

Thanks to Anacronataff and Halge who put here in internationl forum The Explosion in Gothenburg (Sweden 2) on July 4, 2016, Touran 2007.
To be more clear to readers and VW, here is direct translation and picture:

At least one person has been injured and a dog have died when a car exploded in Angered at a gas station on Monday. Two people have been hospitalized.

Two people have been driven by ambulance to the hospital, according to Jack Soderberg, regional production manager at SOS Alarm in southern Sweden. One dog died in the accident.

The place was cordoned off on Monday afternoon, and emergency services have made measurements to determine if it is leaking gas but not found that it does.

- The blast occurred when a man fueled says Joakim, alarm management and operator at the Emergency Services Greater Gothenburg.

- There were three guys in place when I arrived that helped the man. He was bleeding from the leg and seemed to be in shock. Parts of the car was on the roof of the car and gas station. I also saw a dog lying seriously injured outside the car.

- The car was heavily demolished, and need to be towed from the scene, says Ulla Brehm.


Now - First VW reaction is here, at least partial success, Touran recall 2006-2009, only Sweden. What about Germany? What about other cars?? According this thread passat is affected too...., clearly all gas tanks not only first too... last corrosion reported in car built 2011/2012...

http://www.erdgasfahrer-forum.de/viewtopic.php?t=8882&start=165&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=

Here is Sweden 2 = Gothenburg picture>

Picture in Göteborg Posten

{Anm. Bassmann: Please do not post pictures that You don't own. We try hard to respect the rights of other people such as pictures. Links are allowed! B.}
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kiljum



Anmeldedatum: 18.06.2015
Beiträge: 12
Wohnort: Finland

BeitragVerfasst am: 22.07.2016 12:55 Beitrag speichern    Titel: VW recals gas cars in Finland Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

Hello,

I got recall for our 2009 Passat about week ago. Gas tanks of the car have been already replaced in 2014, but I just called to VW dealer if the replaced tanks are correct type. If not, I will get them replaced again.

-MIKKO-
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cnguru



Anmeldedatum: 22.05.2016
Beiträge: 12

BeitragVerfasst am: 28.07.2016 01:05 Beitrag speichern    Titel: cng explosion Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

Unfortunately still new (youngest) rusty tanks reported:

1. VW eco-up baujahr 6/2013, 104.147km (reported 6/2016)
2. VW caddy-maxi baujahr 2014, 60.469km (reported 7/2016)

here is the link:

http://www.erdgasfahrer-forum.de/viewtopic.php?t=8882&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=180
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cnguru



Anmeldedatum: 22.05.2016
Beiträge: 12

BeitragVerfasst am: 29.08.2016 18:08 Beitrag speichern    Titel: new rusty tank report 4/2012 passat ecofuel Antworten mit Zitat Beitrag dem Moderator/Admin melden User zur Ignore Liste hinzufügen

Modell:Passat Variant ecofuel
Baujahr: 04/2012
Probleme mit "Rost an Flaschen" bei Kilometer: 61000
betroffene Flaschen: vordere + mittlere Flasche, getauscht wurden aber alle 3
Datum Austausch: 23.08.2016

here is link:

http://www.erdgasfahrer-forum.de/viewtopic.php?t=8882&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=195
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